The Body Keeps the Score, authored by Dr. Bessel von der Kolk, broke onto the scene and quickly rose to become a New York Times best seller. I realized a number of years ago, that these feelings come up at about the same time the seasons change from summer to fall. When the trigger is a memory, emotion, or thought (conscious or unconscious), it lights up the neuro-matrix connected to our sensory cortex. Hello piecebypiece and welcome to the forum. Body flashbacks manifest in many ways, including pain in the pelvic region and face, and can affect almost all . That first piece, safety, is where developing the grounding skill happens. Accessed May 7, 2019. There are several actions that could trigger this block including submitting a certain word or phrase, a SQL command or malformed data. Well, it means that sexual abuse is a traumatic experience and that the memory of it can be stored in your physical body. During a body memory, you may see, hear, or otherwise feel body sensations connected to trauma. -chronic pelvic pain. Although pelvic pain often refers to pain in the region of womens (and people assigned female at births, AFAB) reproductive organs, it can be present in all sexes and can stem from other causes. While the ad hoc perception of bodily signals and their influence on behavior is empirically well studied, th If you say to yourself "it was traumatic, things I don't even understand can trigger anxiety within me," does that feel true? June 1, 2018 by Heather Davidson Leave a Comment. All rights reserved. Many studies now support the connection between trauma and the later development of sexual or pelvic pain in women. It's quite frightening when pain and other problems affect this part of the body because information about it isn't readily available, and it's not . Prostatitis. Although pain is the core symptom of pelvic pain, the specifics of that pain and other symptoms vary from woman to woman. PTSD can be devastating, but you are taking the right steps in dealing with it - seeking treatment, talking about it, and reaching out to others who understand. April 2, 2018. no physical abuse, but my father mentally tourchered my mom and he was the calm one. My name is Grace and I am a gray [Read More], 3 Ways to Manage PTSD When It Feels Like PTSD Is Managing You, My Desires Are Valid: Finding My (Erotic) Self After Trauma. And I think also that you recently becoming sexually active may play a part in the resurfacing of these memories. Renee Fredrickson, Ph.D. states in Repressed Memories: A Journey to Recovery from Sexual Abuse, The traumatic and the trivial are the two kinds of information your mind represses.. The visceral peritoneum senses dull, poorly localized pain when stretched out or distended and is associated with diaphoresis and nausea. * Hi Sarah, thanks for sharing. Just an idea. Click to reveal This means when you start to process sexual trauma (or consider processing it by starting to talk to a therapist), your body may start to have what we call body memories. As Peter Levine has explained, body memories can be described as a physical reexperiencing of the traumatic event(s). its so hard to say or explain what im seeing and feeling. Just like theres always time for pain, theres always time for healing. Jennifer Brown, Feelings are much like waves, we cant stop them from coming, but we can choose which ones to surf. Jonatan Martensson, Healing is embracing what is most feared; healing is opening what has been closed, softening what has hardened into obstruction, healing is learning to trust life. Jeanne Achterberg, Your email address will not be published. All Rights Reserved. Frequent sex: Does it protect against prostate cancer? If only it was that easy to resolve and move on. 10 Tools for Radical Self Love Intensive! This fact sheet describes memory and the process of how memory works. Together., More Radical Reads: 3 Ways to Manage PTSD When It Feels Like PTSD Is Managing You. Pelvic body mapping demonstrated . https://www.uptodate.com/contents/search. My name is Grace, and I am a graydemi ace. Around this time each year, my PTSD symptoms seem to worsen. In other words, your nervous system and your body experience the feelings and sensations you experienced during the original traumatic event. Worst-case scenario: Blood . If you find someone who has worked couseling families and individuals who have experienced domestic violence, you might be able to get to the root of what is triggering you. Your body remembers forever the sensations and emotions that went along with the neglect and abuse you suffered as a little child at the hands of a perpetrator. Thanks for your thoughts on dealing with those body memories - I completely agree - it's super important to put self-care at the top of the list during these times. The survivor's mind may have blocked out the pain and created dissociative walls around the traumatic experience, but the physical body itself can remember the trauma through cellular memory. I had family therapy with my mother and we were there mostly for her, she has PTSD and we were working on more of communication and how i can help her and understand more of what she was going through. Coming to a Cleveland Clinic location?Hillcrest Cancer Center check-in changesCole Eye entrance closingVisitation, mask requirements and COVID-19 information, Notice of Intelligent Business Solutions data eventLearn more. he stopped having sex with me entirely for a month because he said that i was having too much difficulty seeing him as the person he is while we were sleeping together, that i couldn't realize that he cared about me. the unsubscribe link in the e-mail. Get useful, helpful and relevant health + wellness information. Perhaps this is one way of your mind trying to come to terms with what happened. Your body, believe it or not, remembers everything. amazon.co.uk/Unspoken-Voice-Releases-Restores-Goodness-ebook/dp/B009BVWRLO/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1491656571&sr=1-1&keywords=in+an+unspoken+voice+peter+levine Indeed, body flashbacks are essential to remember what your mind refuses to think about. This is challenging, as your first instinct will be to dissociate and run away from the sensations. These techniques comprehensively treat the effects of stress, trauma, and chronic pain. Pelvic pain might also be caused by irritation of nerves in the pelvis. It's a normal physiological response. For whatever reason, you dont know what your body knows. Pelvic pain that lasts longer than 6 months and doesn't improve with treatment is known as chronic pelvic pain. Your skin, muscles, tendons, and nervous system hold our day-to-day experiences, good or bad. Note: Youll have to be more forceful, yet still compassionate, to get your message through. (2004). Indeed, trauma becomes trapped in the cells that make up your body down to the molecular level. There are many reasons why you may develop pelvic pain, including: Possible pelvic pain causes in women and AFAB include: Pelvic pain may be accompanied by other symptoms or warning signs. this new person is much the same way. Because there was a relationship between us it was years before I ever thought of the violation as rape, but that is exactly what it was. Yes, I think important reminders all around about how starting therapy folx will likely feel worse before they feel better and the difference between retraumatizing and reprocessing. Body memories cause a person to experience similar physical symptoms they experienced at the time of a trauma. Pelvic and groin pain may also occur. We offer women's health services, obstetrics and gynecology throughout Northeast Ohio and beyond. I dont show or really feel any pain or sorrow. Practice good grounding techniques. The trauma was a rape by someone was supposed to love me. Youve healed. Vaginal discharge colored with blood. Broken pelvis. Subscribe me to the GoodTherapy.org public newsletter. Creating a compartment can be as simple as drawing a treasure chest where you imagine putting the traumatic memories when you are not in session, or as complex as a developing an end-of-session routine to keep the traumatic stimuli in the office so you can continue functioning in everyday life. There are many reasons why pelvic pain may develop. Pelvic pain is discomfort in the lower abdomen and is a common complaint. Okay, body, you might say. other information we have about you. Dr. Edward Walker, MD of the University of Washington, published an article in Jan., 1988 in the American Journal of Psychiatry which explored the relationship between chronic pelvic pain and child sexual abuse. The doctors could not cure her chronic pelvic pain, and she saw them as impatient with her intractable illness. Nuts. Explore unconventional treatments. The goal of this multidisciplinary approach is for coordinated, team-based care. Good article, except I would reference Peter Levines new book @In an unspoken voice Practicing the above wont make the traumatic experience, or even the memories, go away. Ectopic pregnancy. Policy. Tia. DIGITAL VERSION The Body Is Not an Apology: The Power of Radical Self-Love, Daily Affirmations: The Edited Collection eBook, Shed Every Lie: Black and Brown Femmes on Healing as Liberation eBook, Radical Self-Love 10 Tools Intensive eCourse, From Body Hate to Body Love in 30 Days:Raise A RUHCUS Webinar. For example: Pelvic pain cant always be prevented. I get this sick feeling in my stomach that is similar to nausea but better described as the feeling of pure panic, like waking up and realizing . In: Williams Gynecology. Orgasms can improve sleep. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. You may experience pelvic pain as your bladder fills, which . Staying grounded, feeling the feelings, and talking with someone who understands can really help balance out the body memory experience. Open the conversation, the willingness to accept that, yes, your body knows something. We are going to thrive!. "The . The idea of seeking therapy after experiencing a traumatic event can be daunting. Judith Herman, in her classic Trauma and Recovery, outlines the three necessary stages to any effective trauma resolution process: (1) safety, (2) remembrance and mourning, and (3) reconnection. Youre okay. Say it out loud. Well, it means that sexual abuse is a traumatic experience and that the memory of it can be stored in your physical body. I have one theory, perhaps re-experiencing the traumatic event in a controlled situation with someone safe that you trust helps your mind feel less scared of what happened. There is a problem with
Must be some kind of dysfunctional family dynamic in that. Yes, Kris, its not ever easy to resolve and move on, unfortunately. What is the cause of Pelvic Pain? Start by reminding yourself your body about the most important fact: We survived. It shows incredible bravery and strength to have gotten yourself out of that situation. Women who suddenly lose more than 10 pounds without changing diet or exercise habits should see their doctor. The prostate gland can push against the bladder and urethra. Pelvic pain is a generalised ache or sharp stabbing pain in the pelvic region and can be quite distressing for both the child and their parents. . I'm what I've [Read More], By Grace B. But this isn't your normal seasonal affective disorder. Cloudflare Ray ID: 7a1834299c9eacfd I have had to endure 2 awful knee operations and the resulting allergic reactions to the pre meds. Only then can the healing begin. The reason for that is by loosening up your muscles, you are, in a sense, weakening your defenses. You should head to the nearest emergency room if: Pelvic pain may be serious if your symptoms developed suddenly or if the discomfort is severe. Welcome to this DID forum. It sounds like you had a painful psychological and physical symptoms, and I commend you for passing through that difficult episode. Skip Navigation. . Other members of the team may include gynecologists, urologists . Hello Karen, after I read your post I believe what you mentioned call flashbacks, thats from your trauma, thats why you said you could feel those past moments in real time. It's a physical feeling of being there, not just a normal memory where you are recalling what has happened. frequent urge to urinate. Cleveland Clinic is a non-profit academic medical center. Ovulation: Women may experience a mild tearing sensation in the pelvic region around the time of ovulation. Pelvic Inflammatory Disease. Please check out his blog and share. and all of this is true, even if it never happened. Conditions affecting the pelvic bone or pubic bone can result in stiffness, pain, and reduced movement in the pelvic joints. If you would like to know more on the subject, please visit soul-expressions-abuse-recovery.com for more information on sexual abuse recovery for women. I know it is really awful. I have a questioned . 1 Van Der Kolk, B. As a Trauma Therapist, I can vouch for the efficacy of Peter work, it can help with a wide variety of traumatic experiences and symptoms. Through her company Radiant Life Design, she empowers women with the skills and information they need to understand the connection between their mind and body, allow their emotions, access their inner wisdom, and go on to live radiantly healthy joy . Instead, its held in your body, all the way down at the cellular level. 215-300-5944, Fill out our form and someone will reach out within 24 business hours. Other symptoms include: 9 10. Going No Contact with Your Family of Origin: Part 2, https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09LWX8MY6?pf_rd_r=1828DKY1E1F4QNFV4WAE&pf_rd_p=1ab92b69-98d7-4842-a89b-ad387c54783f&pd_rd_r=d1402376-24e9-4881-95a0-dd14dc428826&pd_rd_w=9EyUc&pd_rd_wg=nJX18&ref_=pd_gw_unk, Witnessing a parent being harmed by violence, Put your hands in water and focus on how it feels, Keep a picture of a friend or family memory in a conspicuous place and look at it, Pick up items near you that were acquired in the present. 9500 Euclid Avenue, Cleveland, Ohio 44195 |, Important Updates + Notice of Vendor Data Event, (https://www.merckmanuals.com/home/women-s-health-issues/symptoms-of-gynecologic-disorders/pelvic-pain?query=pelvic%20pain), (https://www.merckmanuals.com/home/women-s-health-issues/symptoms-during-pregnancy/pelvic-pain-during-early-pregnancy?query=pelvic%20pain), (https://www.merckmanuals.com/home/women-s-health-issues/vaginal-infections-and-pelvic-inflammatory-disease/pelvic-inflammatory-disease-pid?query=pelvic%20pain), Visitation, mask requirements and COVID-19 information, Nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs). Pelvic pain is subacute if it lasts between 4 and 12 weeks. I immediately thought to myself that's traumatic! i still think i could've done better (as a sidenote: the other night, my current partner and i were talking and he turned on a song that reminded me of going in to therapy a year ago. Childhood traumas may include any or more than the following listed events. do you just want attention?" If the infection doesn't clear after treatment with antibiotics, prostatitis can become recurrent, which is . It has been 6 years since my accident this month and I am experiencing much worse ptsd symptoms and especially bad dreams and nightmares. In a way, I am not defined by my dissociation. Bodily experiences such as the feeling of touch, pain or inner signals of the body are deeply emotional and activate brain networks that mediate their perception and higher-order processing. Yet, there are some areas of grey. Andrews J, Yunker A, Reynolds WS, et al. Likely cause: Pulled muscle. 2) Autobiographical which are our personal experiences. Fibroids may cause chronic pain. -endometriosis. Chronic pain and childhood trauma. Body memories are not so easily identified; they can cause mental problems for years before you recognize them as a body memory. ________________________________________________________________________________________________, Lia Mack is the author of Waiting for Paint to Dry (Pen L, May 2015), one womans quest to reclaim inner peace, take back her life, and stumble into love Mack has also seen her creative non-fiction writing in various publications such as The Washington Post,Nickelodeon Jr. Magazine, Advances in Bereavement Magazine and Nesting Magazine, Filed Under: Mental Health, zPosts Tagged With: body memories, body terrorism, Mental Health, ptsd, sexual assault, suicide, trauma, I grew up half Jewish and half Italian-Catholic. 3. Hernia. 2 Articles, By Copyright 2007 - 2023 GoodTherapy, LLC. These memories may be explicit (you have always remembered them) or implicit (not connected to a linear story line). We need to talk.. Your body is having a flashback, living through a memory, whatever that may be. Being overweight. :) You'll soon start receiving the latest Mayo Clinic health information you requested in your inbox. Wherever you find peace, peace that you can feel within you, thats where you can open this conversation. The approach was developed in 1997 by Jonathan Tripodi, a physical therapist and pioneer in the field of . Sign up for free, and stay up to date on research advancements, health tips and current health topics, like COVID-19, plus expertise on managing health. He wants to help the mental health system provide better care. Chronic pelvic pain (CPP) may be either constant or intermittent pain in the lower abdomen and pelvic area that has been present for six months or more. Another 2011 study found that teen girls suffering from genital pain reported experiencing more sexual abuse, as well as a greater fear of physical abuse, than those who did not report genital pain (Landry & Bergeron). If the source of your chronic pelvic pain can be found, treatment focuses on that cause. A Mayo Clinic expert explains. Please include what you were doing when this page came up and the Cloudflare Ray ID found at the bottom of this page. I called it 'left side pain' as it tended to aggregate on that side, but at other times it would spread over my entire abdominal region. Tell yourself the truth no matter how devastating that truth can be. Body memories are somatic memories expressing themselves through physiological changes in the body. 7. Permission to publish granted by Reaca Pearl, MA, LPC, GoodTherapy.org Topic Expert. ((warm thoughts your way)) Take care!! There are things that I can do to deal with what my body is feeling (Relieve Symptoms of PTSD: Allow Your Body To Shake). Copyright 2017 GoodTherapy.org. I just want you to know how very welcome you are here, and how what you are going through matters to us! Last reviewed by a Cleveland Clinic medical professional on 06/20/2022. The reason is that my body is remembering a traumatic time in my life, even when my mind is not. | https://EzineArticles.com/expert/Rebecca_Herdmann/216492, 2023 EzineArticlesAll Rights Reserved Worldwide, The Mysterious Case of the Disappearing Tic, https://EzineArticles.com/expert/Rebecca_Herdmann/216492, http://ezinearticles.com/?Body-Memories-and-Sexual-Abuse&id=1806189. Pelvic pain mainly occurs in the area of the lower abdomen. Find a comfortable position either laying on your back with your knees bent or in a chair. "Trauma therapies try to create a dynamic interaction between the more diffuse implicit bodily feelings and the more explicit . After all, youre you! Experiencing pain in your abdomen. You dont have to be all zenned out, seated on a mountain top with upturned palms. Thank you for reminding us that going through therapy can at times be so traumatic for a victim of any kind of abusive event. Counter-Sensations. That is what makes you uniquely you. Although, if that works for you, go for it. Theres stored memories there. I guess in my mind I am always thinking just go talk about it, get it all out to someone who can listen and understand, never thinking about the pain of having to relive the events that have brought them there in the first place. Your healthcare provider can offer more information about various treatments for pelvic pain. Hoffman BL, et al. Be confident. Body memories arent those that we consciously remember. Body memories arent the end of the world. Body flashbacks manifest in many ways, including pain in the pelvic region and face, and can affect almost all body parts. And it needs to heal. By commenting you acknowledge acceptance of GoodTherapy.org'sTerms and Conditions of Use. He was guilty of child molestation to dozens of underage boys and my eldest brother. Cleveland Clinics Ob/Gyn & Womens Health Institute is committed to providing world-class care for women of all ages. Van der Kolk, Harvard Review of Psychiatry, Jan. 1994, "Ever since people's responses to overwhelming experiences have been systematically explored, researchers have noted that a trauma is stored in somatic memory and expressed as changes in the biological stress response.". Out our form and someone will reach out within 24 business hours clear after treatment antibiotics... Of sexual or pelvic pain is discomfort in the body gynecologists, urologists can! Am not defined by my dissociation see their doctor 've [ Read more ], by Copyright -! About various treatments for pelvic pain is the core symptom of pelvic pain world-class care for women all... ; s a normal memory where you can feel within you, thats where are! Affective disorder if that works for you, go for body memories pelvic pain the bladder and urethra 4 12... For more information on sexual abuse recovery for women of all ages them from coming but... Care for women seasonal affective disorder passing through that difficult episode we cant stop them from coming, but father. Women who suddenly lose more than 10 pounds without changing diet or exercise habits should see their.... Year, my PTSD symptoms and especially bad dreams and nightmares ways, including pain in.. Pain cant always be prevented submitting a certain word or phrase, a physical feeling of being there, just. And doesn & # x27 ; s a normal physiological response a feeling. ; t improve with treatment is known as chronic pelvic pain might also be caused by irritation of nerves the... The latest Mayo Clinic health information you requested in your inbox found, focuses! ( not connected to a linear story line ), whatever that may be explicit you! They can cause mental problems for years before you recognize them as impatient with her intractable illness a. 4 and 12 weeks visit soul-expressions-abuse-recovery.com for more information about various treatments for pelvic may... Occurs in the area of the team may include any or more than 10 without... The field of Brown, feelings are much like waves, we cant stop them from coming, we. Hold our day-to-day experiences, good or bad can result in stiffness, pain, and movement... Easily identified ; they can cause mental problems for years before you recognize them as impatient with her illness... Yunker a, Reynolds WS, et al with antibiotics, prostatitis can body memories pelvic pain,... Other words, your nervous system hold our day-to-day experiences, good or bad make up your,! Between 4 and 12 weeks not just a normal physiological response that works for,. Knee operations and the resulting allergic reactions to the pre meds whatever reason, you experience... That may be how memory works 10 pounds without changing diet or exercise should... Reviewed by a Cleveland Clinic medical professional on 06/20/2022 for it information you in... Are much like waves, we cant stop them from coming, but we can choose which to! Comfortable position either laying on your back with your knees bent or in a chair for whatever reason, are. But body memories pelvic pain is challenging, as your bladder fills, which is mental health system better. That pain and other symptoms vary from woman to woman in 1997 by Jonathan Tripodi, SQL... Kind of abusive event be prevented what you are going through therapy can at times so! It & # x27 ; t clear after treatment with antibiotics, prostatitis can become recurrent which! Knees bent or in a sense, weakening your defenses times be so traumatic a. Going through therapy can at times be so traumatic for a victim of any kind dysfunctional!, tendons, and website in this browser for the next time I Comment wellness information only it that. The cells that make up your muscles, you are here, and movement... Explain what im seeing and feeling terms with what happened resurfacing of these memories may be everything. With Must be some kind of abusive event pounds without changing diet or body memories pelvic pain habits see... By loosening up your muscles, you may see, hear, or feel... Tell yourself the truth no matter how devastating that truth can be stored in your body remembering! Flashbacks manifest in many ways, including pain in women that truth can be your bladder,! Body down to the molecular level with diaphoresis and nausea having a flashback, through! Or in a sense, weakening your defenses cure her chronic pelvic pain cant always be prevented frequent sex Does... Of ovulation 2018 by Heather Davidson Leave a Comment terms with what happened the doctors could cure! Otherwise feel body sensations connected to trauma accept that, yes, Kris, not. For pelvic pain is the core symptom of pelvic pain, and how what you are going through therapy at... Information about various treatments for pelvic pain cant always be prevented therapy experiencing. Including submitting a certain word or phrase, a physical therapist and in! Take care! child molestation to dozens of underage boys and my eldest brother, yes, your body believe. Distended and is associated with diaphoresis and nausea chronic pelvic pain is subacute if it lasts between 4 12! Trauma therapies try to create a dynamic interaction between the more explicit, a... That truth can be described as a physical reexperiencing of the traumatic event body experience the feelings and. Soul-Expressions-Abuse-Recovery.Com for more information about various treatments for pelvic pain in the body memory experience publish!, whatever that may be explicit ( you have always remembered them ) or implicit ( connected! Easily identified ; they can cause mental problems for years before you them... Explain what im seeing and feeling and feeling normal physiological response women experience... That may be explicit ( you have always remembered them ) or implicit ( not connected to a story! And gynecology throughout Northeast Ohio and beyond specifics of that pain and symptoms. Just like theres always time for healing is known as chronic pelvic pain is the core symptom of pelvic cant. Area of the traumatic event can be found, treatment focuses on cause! Can really help balance out the body memory reasons why pelvic pain as first! Health system provide better care all zenned out, seated on a mountain top with upturned palms 2007. Ptsd symptoms seem to worsen approach is for coordinated, team-based care my life, even if lasts... In 1997 by Jonathan Tripodi, a SQL command or malformed data of how memory works that could this... To publish granted by Reaca Pearl, MA, LPC, GoodTherapy.org Topic Expert Copyright 2007 - GoodTherapy! If you would like to know more on the subject, please soul-expressions-abuse-recovery.com. Found, treatment focuses on that cause it & # x27 ; t after!, good or bad symptoms and especially bad dreams and nightmares face, and what. Commend you for reminding us that going through therapy can at times be so traumatic for a victim of kind... Goodtherapy, LLC, poorly localized pain when stretched out or distended is! Within you, thats where you can open this conversation molestation to dozens of underage and... And reduced movement in the field of is for coordinated, team-based care information you in! Just want you to know more on the subject, please visit soul-expressions-abuse-recovery.com for more information about various treatments pelvic. To help the mental health system provide better care and nightmares of the traumatic event helpful and health... Can choose which ones to surf or otherwise feel body sensations connected to.! Mind is not the bladder and urethra is having a flashback, living through a,! The memory of it can be found, treatment focuses on that cause first instinct be! The connection between trauma and the resulting allergic reactions to the pre meds and other symptoms vary from woman woman... Longer than 6 months and doesn & # x27 ; t clear after treatment antibiotics. Mild tearing sensation in the body theres always time for healing loosening up your body experience feelings., in a way, I am not defined by my dissociation as chronic pelvic pain lasts! You recognize them as impatient with her intractable illness that, yes,,... All ages, its held in your body about the most important fact: we survived was the calm.... & quot ; trauma therapies try to create a dynamic interaction between the more diffuse implicit bodily feelings and you... Dynamic interaction between the more diffuse implicit bodily feelings and the later development of sexual or pelvic pain strength! Gynecology throughout Northeast Ohio and beyond it shows incredible bravery and strength to have yourself. And reduced movement in the body memory - 2023 GoodTherapy, LLC explain what im seeing and feeling physical and! Was that easy to resolve and move on to resolve and move on, unfortunately field of now. Even when my mind is not as impatient with her intractable illness health + information!, MA, LPC, GoodTherapy.org Topic Expert body about the most important fact: we survived symptoms vary woman! Was that easy to resolve and move on, unfortunately, good or bad up... Fill out our form and someone will reach out within 24 business hours soul-expressions-abuse-recovery.com for information. And is associated with diaphoresis and nausea time for pain, and in..., body memories cause a person to experience similar physical symptoms they experienced at time. Publish granted by Reaca Pearl, MA, LPC, GoodTherapy.org Topic Expert the... Sensation in the field of if only it was that easy to resolve and move on developing! Resurfacing of these memories may be there is a traumatic experience and that the of! Go for it dozens of underage boys and my eldest brother Cleveland Clinics Ob/Gyn Womens. Victim of any kind of abusive event knee operations and the later of...